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Gun Control Debate Re-Emerges
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senders
July 23, 2012, 5:19pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted Text
You can remove guns from those who shouldn't have them just like we removed Half of all Drunks from our
roads.


but did they?

based on what statistical formula?

hell, we can remove/restrict car ownership and it would have the same effect, depending on the formula used of course.


...you are a product of your environment, your environment is a product of your priorities, your priorities are a product of you......

The replacement of morality and conscience with law produces a deadly paradox.


STOP BEING GOOD DEMOCRATS---STOP BEING GOOD REPUBLICANS--START BEING GOOD AMERICANS

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 5:31pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox



The facts are that DWI laws and DWI campaigns have cut the number of DWI deaths in half.  But of course
there were people back then saying the same things that you are saying today..."you cannot legislate
responsible behavior."

You can remove guns from those who shouldn't have them just like we removed Half of all Drunks from our
roads.


Not true at all. There is no evidence to support the premise that half as many drunks are on the road.

Perhaps all the bad driving drunks self corrected themselves by way of accidents or arrest.

There is absolutely no evidence to support the idea that less drunks are on the road.

Better lawyers alone would skew the results of alcohol related convictions.

In addition, all cars now have air bags and mandatory seatbelt use.

1982 stats did not have these restrictions in place.

For all you know, the seat belts, lower speed limits and more educated people are the reason for the reduction.

Plus, just keep ignoring the fact doctors kill 120,000 people per year accidentally.

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55tbird
July 23, 2012, 5:32pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Box A Rox


IF that's how your feel, then lets drop all our DWI laws.  Lets stop breathalizer tests and lets go back to
the 50's and 60's when driving drunk and killing someone was looked upon as an ACCIDENT instead of
what it is... risking everyone's life who's on the road with you.
Alcohol-related deaths in the US since 1982:

Total fatalities
Alcohol-related fatalities
From 1982 when there were 26,173 DWI deaths at 60% of all highway deaths.
to 2009 with 12,744 DWI deaths which were 38% of all highway deaths.

The facts are that DWI laws and DWI campaigns have cut the number of DWI deaths in half.  But of course
there were people back then saying the same things that you are saying today..."you cannot legislate
responsible behavior."

You can remove guns from those who shouldn't have them just like we removed Half of all Drunks from our
roads.


there is alot more to it than just more penalties and regulation. the younger generation frankily does not drink as much as prior generations. thats why you see taverns closing and struggling in a big way, but what they are doing is texting and using cell phones...btw, hows that that cell phone law working? its just a different form of irresponsible behavior.






"Arguing with liberals is like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock out the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around like it is victorious." - Author Unknown
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Box A Rox
July 23, 2012, 5:40pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Libertarian4life

Plus, just keep ignoring the fact doctors kill 120,000 people per year accidentally.

Good!  Doctors kill 120,000 people a year.  So should we correct that issue?  Should we be looking for
ways to prevent or lessen those deaths???
Or should we just do what many on this board do about gun deaths... Smile and say there is no
solution so get used to the carnage?


The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 6:06pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox

Good!  Doctors kill 120,000 people a year.  So should we correct that issue?  Should we be looking for
ways to prevent or lessen those deaths???
Or should we just do what many on this board do about gun deaths... Smile and say there is no
solution so get used to the carnage?


We should be concentrating on the major causes of death.

Gun laws aren't the way to save lives.

No law has ever saved a life.

Guns save lives.

Ask the police.

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senders
July 23, 2012, 6:16pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Libertarian4life


We should be concentrating on the major causes of death.

Gun laws aren't the way to save lives.

No law has ever saved a life.

Guns save lives.

Ask the police.



no law has ever saved a life is a TRUTH......

law is meant for PUNISHMENT NOT PRECRIME....

precrime exists in the human psyche/community.....

precrime....abortions are legal because it prevents poor folks from producing hungry humans without education
and prevents future criminals.....

and don't forget the 1%'ers get to 'save face'....the only time those pesky 1%'ers reach down and agree with Box


...you are a product of your environment, your environment is a product of your priorities, your priorities are a product of you......

The replacement of morality and conscience with law produces a deadly paradox.


STOP BEING GOOD DEMOCRATS---STOP BEING GOOD REPUBLICANS--START BEING GOOD AMERICANS

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Henry
July 23, 2012, 10:21pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox


Again... I CLEARLY DO WANT A WELL ARMED, A WELL REGULATED MILITIA!

It's called the US MILITARY!  Your right wing anti govt perversion of the second amendment has no bearing
on the actual meaning.  
IMO, your view of an armed citizen for the purpose of overthrowing the people that America elected, borders
on treason.  

Arm the Occupy Wall street people in a revolt against their government... You'd call  it treason.
Arm the Environmentalists in a revolt against their government... You'd consider it insurrection.
Arm a band of TeaBaggers with "don't tread on me" signs... you consider it your 2nd amendment right.

Total BS!

   SO which group has a right to arm & actually shoot at their own government? To shoot at police
and our Military?
  Which group has a right to start a war in our streets against our government?
  Your crazy group of Right Wing Militia??? Because the 2nd amendment says so???
What a joke!


LMAO a typical liberal rant based on no facts, I'm sure if you lived back in the 1700's you would call those men at Lexington traitors, funny thing thing is that the British at Lexington were sent to do the same as you wish to do, confiscate and eliminate what is now the 2nd amendment. Militia at that time was not the military, it was not the Contenental army, it was defined as any abled body person, the closest we have today of a well regulated militia would be the National Guard, that still doesn't eliminate "the right of the people" and that is why it was written. As for the reason of the 2nd, it is written, "for the security of a FREE state", this our last resort for the protection of our rights against any form of tyranny be it from a foreign power or God help us tyranny from within.

Which group has a right to overthrow their government? that is the right of the people, I suggest you read the Declaration of Independence you might learn something. We have checks and balances that are in place to protect our liberties right now, although by some chance the checks and balances become useless what do you expect people to do, live under tyranny?



"In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot."

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Henry
July 23, 2012, 10:55pm Report to Moderator

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"In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot."

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:01pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox

I'm sure your response makes a lot of sense to you Senders, but most of the time... It sounds like a
random selection of phrases.  


He doesn't seem to be able to form sentences.

He posts fragments and lists and often it is difficult to understand his position on most issues.

Most of the time it seems like he gets started, then it turns into sarcasm.

It's really hard to decipher.

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:03pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from senders


you seem to think that just removing guns = removing human response/actions/choices etc.....


Wow, that is much better.

I also agree with you. Taking the guns would merely transfer the actions to other objects.

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:20pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox

In the perfect world, criminals and the mentally ill couldn't have a CHOICE in the decision to buy guns.
I do think that removing guns from a small number of people will greatly reduce these kinds of criminal
acts.
Your option is to just get used to the carnage.


Gun sales are heavily regulated and most states perform background checks, require references and/or waiting periods for certain purchases.

New York currently requires 4 references, a local police dept background check, fingerprinting, a mental health dept. background check and the FBI check before issuing a pistol license. A judge makes the final determination.

It is also recommended that one of your references be your spouse as they will have to share the home with your weapons.

Any person that meets these qualifications should be allowed to purchase any type of weapon made, including assault type weapons.

Rifles and shotguns sales are not regulated except by age.

Casual sales of rifles and shotguns between adults are totally unregulated.

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:23pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from senders


no law has ever saved a life is a TRUTH......

law is meant for PUNISHMENT NOT PRECRIME....

precrime exists in the human psyche/community.....

precrime....abortions are legal because it prevents poor folks from producing hungry humans without education
and prevents future criminals.....


Wow!

That is one of the most outrageous statements regarding abortion ever made.

Abortions are legal to prevent the poor from producing criminals.

You realize that is totally not why abortions are legal.

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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:41pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox

In the perfect world, criminals and the mentally ill couldn't have a CHOICE in the decision to buy guns.
I do think that removing guns from a small number of people will greatly reduce these kinds of criminal
acts.
Your option is to just get used to the carnage.


You going to ban garage sales and craigslist?

Guns are sold and traded everywhere, every day.

You can't stop them from getting into the wrong hands by forcing citizens to qualify for an inalienable right.

I would have thought that rights would be self evident to you.

The founding fathers coined the term self evident truths.

All men are created equal doesn't mean with a government issued background check.

If someone is charged with a crime or is deemed mentally ill, they are disallowed from purchasing weapons.

It makes no sense to search everyone's background before allowing them their inalienable right to bear arms.

If the wrong person ends up with them, they get punished.

That's the way the US works.

Writing more laws and pissing off more citizens, will only create more militia types drooling for a chance to stop the government from trampling their rights.

The anti gun people are brainwashed by government warnings and sensationalized headlines.

Guns never killed anyone. People did.

Gun laws never saved a life or prevented anyone from committing a crime with a gun.

Guns are proven lifesaving tools.

All tools are dangerous.

Criminals can kill with a hammer just as easily as a gun.

Remember a couple days ago, one of the posters asked if he could charge his nail gun in his car?

There ya have it.

People will improvise.

The war in Iraq was US sophisticated weaponry against IEDs.

Improvised explosive devices.

Take away guns and they will also improvise here.

You'll regret taking the guns quickly.
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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:44pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Tommy


They (used to anyway) drive to drug stores with a couple of other people and either buy a few bottles a piece, and then drive to all the rest of the stores, or they would just order massive amounts of it online which (I just checked Ebay) is still possible.


Sudafed is freely available in Canada.



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Libertarian4life
July 23, 2012, 11:48pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox

Good!  Doctors kill 120,000 people a year.  So should we correct that issue?  Should we be looking for
ways to prevent or lessen those deaths???
Or should we just do what many on this board do about gun deaths... Smile and say there is no
solution so get used to the carnage?


Your idea of over regulation and or banning would certainly not help doctors stop accidentally killing people.

Maybe if the doctors weren't worrying about the DEA taking their license for alleviating suffering they could pay better attention to the needs of the patients.

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