This whole issue is very annoying. Although I say my rosary each day, it is a sacramental used to pray. It is not a piece of jewelry. That being said, if that rosary is so important to this young man, why not wear it on the inside of the shirt? Also the school district is nuts for taking this on. The Schdy school district is so out of touch that they are becoming scary. Do they tell an observant Jewish boy he cannot wear a kippah (yamulke) or a Muslim girl she cannot cover her head? No--so let the Catholic kid (is he Catholic?) wear the rosary. In my opinion he should not display it but really who cares. What is even scarier is that some conservative Christian is taking this on as a test case. Can't imagine where that is headed.
We, as a nation, are losing our civil rights little by little. Do we really need the government (school system) to tell ANYONE what religious article to wear? From a burka to rosaries to a yamulke! That is ALL personal choice.
Show me the 'written law' where kids can't wear religious articles to school. Whether I agree with them or not, it should be a decision between the parent and child. It is none of their damn business!
Then strock drags the family's history through the mud. BRILLIANT! And then they question whether the kid is really catholic or not! WTH....it is none of their damn business or mine or anyone else for that matter!!! >
When the INSANE are running the ASYLUM In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
“How fortunate for those in power that people never think.” Adolph Hitler
Suit seeks right for teen to wear beads to class Complaint against Schenectady district claims youth should be able to show rosary in school
By LAUREN STANFORTH, Staff writer First published in print: Wednesday, June 2, 2010
SCHENECTADY -- A conservative Christian not-for-profit has filed a federal lawsuit against the Schenectady school district demanding it allow a 13-year-old boy to wear rosary beads to school.
The American Center for Law and Justice, which is paying the boy's legal fees, filed the complaint in U.S. District Court Tuesday saying the Oneida Middle School student's First and Fourteenth Amendment rights have been violated. The teen, Raymond Hosier, was first suspended May 17 for wearing the rosary with purple beads and a large white Crucifix because school officials said beads are considered a gang-related symbol............>>>>...............>>>>..............Read more: http://www.timesunion.com/AspS.....2/2010#ixzz0pgzYZ3pK
While I disagree with the Schenectady school district for barring rosary beads of all things, I find the actions of Raymond Hosier Jr. and his mother far more offensive [May 25 Gazette]. The laws protecting religious freedom were designed to protect individuals observing their own religion, not to encourage others to make a mockery of religious observance. Raymond has no clue, as he has admitted, of the significance of the rosary, nor is he of the Catholic faith. He appears to be a troubled youth, claiming the deaths of family members drove him to suddenly wear this religious symbol, craving attention. And does the school district deal with him or do they stand behind their zero tolerance policies? Does his mother comfort him or get him the professional treatment he so publicly craves? No, both have abandoned him, preferring to make a Fox News special out of Raymond’s desire to avoid school in general. Raymond is using the rosary, and his mother is aiding and abetting him, to garner attention. She is not teaching him about freedom of religion, she is teaching him how to avoid dealing with life and to take his 15 minutes of fame, deserved or not. Both need to grow up before Raymond thinks that whining and abusing a religious symbol is the way to adulthood. And Daniel Weaver [May 30 Gazette] needs to focus his articulate defense on real issues, not pretenders like Raymond and his equally confused mother.
By LAUREN STANFORTH, Staff writer First published in print: Thursday, June 3, 2010
SCHENECTADY -- A federal judge has ruled that an Oneida Middle School student may continue to wear his rosary in school while the matter is being argued in court.
Albany-based U.S. District Court Judge Lawrence E. Kahn signed a court order Tuesday that directed the school to let the boy attend class until motions are heard in the case on June 11. The order was in response to a complaint filed by the American Center for Law and Justice on Tuesday that asked that a temporary restraining order be granted against the school district until the center's complaint can be heard. The conservative Christian organization filed a federal lawsuit against the Schenectady school district demanding it allow 13-year-old Raymond Hosier wear rosary beads to school, saying his First and Fourteenth Amendment rights have been violated....................>>>>............>>>>............Read more: http://www.timesunion.com/AspS.....3/2010#ixzz0pmxbj400
Weaver wrong, city school district right, on rosary bead rule
Re May 30 Viewpoint, “Academic injustice”: I read, with a mixture of amusement and horror, Daniel T. Weaver’s defense of rosary wearing in Schenectady schools. I never thought I’d have occasion to say this but, on this issue, the Schenectady school district is right. Let’s deal with the simple part fi rst. Mr. Weaver claims, “The rosary is more than just a set of prayer beads. It is also a symbol of Roman Catholicism. Like any symbol, it is meant to be displayed, not hidden.” I don’t know Mr. Weaver’s religion but, as a practicing Catholic, I can assure him that rosaries are not for display, certainly not as a fashion accessory. While the adverb “just” inappropriately diminishes their importance in Catholic devotion, rosaries are, in fact, prayer beads. Their purpose is to make points with God, not to make a point to the Schenectady school district; and wearing them around one’s neck is disrespectful. But, then, the Catholic Church is one of the few institutions that an American can disrespect without being charged with “hate speech.” Mr. Weaver goes on to adorn this adolescent misbehavior with the Bill of Rights, equating it with students celebrating their own cultures in their hairstyles. But jewelry or haircuts that celebrate a student’s heritage are different from, and usually distinguishable from, those that insult a different culture or signify gang affiliation. Schools do have to sort that out, and the less “help” they get from a judge, the better. Defining the appropriate rights of minors is more challenging than defi ning the appropriate use of a rosary. Applying those rights to a school environment is even trickier. Does the Fourth Amendment prohibit the search of a student’s locker? Do students have a First Amendment right to assemble in gangs? Do they have a free-speech right to display gang regalia? And what of their right to bear arms? Some answers are easy, some are not; but the goal is always the welfare of the child. Consequently, the Constitution’s protection of an adult’s right to make bad decisions does not extend to children. Moreover, schools have the mission of imparting knowledge, wisdom, ethics and sociability to a largely unwilling group of adolescents who have the need for all of that and a right to receive it — even against their wills. Certainly, the expression by students of their opinions, wise or silly, is a part of that process and should generally be applauded and nurtured. But when a student’s self-expression interrupts the school’s decorum, it interferes with the school’s mission, and tolerating it cheats that student and all of his classmates. Moreover, any parent who permits it practices an insidious form of child abuse. The rights of children begin with the right to be protected. In some cases, the court must protect a child from his own parents or from school administrators acting against his interest. More frequently though, it’s parents, teachers, or school administrators protecting the child from himself. Mr. Weaver would deny children that right.
June 3, 2010 Day of the Rosary At least in the “Independent Voice of the Capital Region” By Pat Zollinger
Today was a three-banger on superfluous opinions regarding Ray Hosier and his desire to wear a “rosary.” Actually (to keep all of us in the real world) the rosary we’re talking about is a beaded necklace with a crucifix attached. What this actually is, is a tool used to count the “prayers” and penance (confessions) of the Rosary. In fact, the word rosary comes from Latin and means a garland of roses, the rose being one of the flowers used to symbolize the Virgin Mary, Mother of Jesus Christ.
The following exerts were taken from Wikipedia:
Quoted Text The rosary is part of the Catholic veneration of Mary, which has been promoted by numerous popes. Many similar prayer practices exist in other Christian communities, each with its own set of prescribed prayers and its own form of prayer beads, such as the prayer rope in Eastern Orthodox Christianity. The rosary is sometimes used by other Christians, especially in Lutheranism, the Anglican Communion and the Old Catholic Church.
Please note the use of the word “Christians” in the above quote. Ray Hosier never claimed to be “Catholic”, simply Christian. And besides, what thirteen year old kid or any adult for that matter, can claim ultimate knowledge of what they think their religion is?
And as far as “wearing” the rosary, Wikipedia states:
Quoted Text
Wearing of the Rosary ------------------------- Wearing of a Rosary that one actually uses to pray is neither uncommon nor sacrilegious in various Roman Catholic-adherent cultures and was a common practice in the Medieval and Renaissance periods, particularly among the religious (monks, nuns, and friars). Rosaries are also worn hanging from or looped over a belt, particularly with some religious habits, pinned to and hanging from a shoulder or neckline, or wrapped around a wrist or arm as a bracelet. Some Catholic Christians feel that it is sacrilegious for a non-believer to wear a rosary around the neck. This is particularly true in Roman Catholic cultures that have histories of persecution, particularly among the Irish and English Catholics. Because Irish Catholic tradition is often seen as normative in the United States and Canada, this has been the source of some conflict in the past. The Roman Catholic Church states: "Sacred objects, set aside for divine worship by dedication or blessing, are to be treated with reverence. They are not to be made over to secular or inappropriate use, even though they may belong to private persons". Thus it is acceptable to wear a rosary if one is doing so to show veneration, however it is not acceptable if one is wearing the rosary irreverently, such as wearing it as a piece of jewelry. Many saints have worn their rosary around the neck, and in the Secret of the Rosary, it is mentioned that a person put his rosary around his neck to keep demons away from him.
All of this discussion about the Rosary in Schenectady stems from this thirteen year old boy wearing a rosary on the outside of his clothing, as a necklace, in remembrance of his dead “older” brother (some news reports stated Joey Hosier as being younger except that Raymond was his “younger” brother when Joey died) and a recently deceased uncle. The City of Schenectady School District has a policy that “anything” which could be construed as being “gang related”, including the beads on this rosary must not be worn by any student except inside their clothing. Raymond Hosier was suspended twice because he wore this rosary and with the help of his mother, Chantell Hosier, he is now being defended for his constitutional right to wear it by the American Center for Law and Justice.
So why am I writing this article? Because today in the Daily Gazette there was not one, not two but three references of total BS and ignorance to Raymond Hosier and the issue of his wearing a rosary to school.
The first one was the “editorial” which never has an editor’s name attached to it and therefore must be construed to be the position of the newspaper and its owners. The owners (who claim they are “The Locally Owned Voice of the Capital Region”) apparently are one John E. N. Hume III, President, one Elizabeth L. Lind, Vice President, one William S. Hume, Secretary and one Ernest R. Grandy, Treasurer. Now I don’t know who these people are but I for one will state that they are not MY voice and for them to claim that they are the “voice of the capital region” is disingenuous at best.
The so-called “editors” of this newspaper, the ones who apparently do the ghost writing for what it calls “Editorials” are Arthur Clayman, Opinion Page Editor and Judy Patrick, Managing Editor. Now I know for a fact that other people write editorials too, but they aren’t listed. It’s much too easy to write a bunch of crap that you don’t sign your name to, so all I as a reader can do is assume that the owners of the newspaper and the listed editors are the ones behind the editorials.
And not only have these editorials degraded into tabloid trash, the letters accepted by the public as well as an old worn-out reporter turned columnist depicts the trashy attitudes of the owners. Business must be bad for them to stoop as low as they have with respect to a grieving 13 year old kid and his family. Millions of people can attest to the fact that there is no “time limit” to the grieving process. Every person experiencing grief manages that grief to the best of their ability and in their own way.
The editorial that I speak of is at the top left of A9, the Opinion Page and is titled “Round and round on the rosaries.” Nice title, so utterly respectful of any readers’ religious beliefs and the sacredness behind the meaning of the Rosary as well as showing the highest degree of maturity. Raymond believes that the spirit of his brother and uncle lie within the physical composition of the rosary he wears. But the editors of the Daily Gazette state:
Quoted Text Rosary beads are unquestionably a religious symbol, but only for Catholics. And, with the exception of clergy, Catholics who do use rosaries don’t wear them.
Nonsense! Their own ignorance in the form of their written words comes out loud and clear. There are no set rules for using prayer beads, rosaries or otherwise. People of all religions and faiths use and wear prayer beads for however best fits their needs. They may wear them as a reminder for them to say the prayers and adhere to the rituals of their faith, or as in Raymond’s case, to remind him always of his brother and uncle.
But the Daily Gazette’s ulterior motive came out earlier in the editorial when they stated this:
Quoted Text This case has already been turned into a national cause célèbre, what with the right-wing American Center for Law and Justice (ACLJ) intervening on Hosier’s behalf and filing a lawsuit.
Right wing? So what’s the big deal? An association whose own cause is to help people pursue justice in the court system is essentially being denigrated by this newspaper. Right wing, left wing, chicken wings! That’s how I would put it. What matters to me is that we the people are allowed to retain our freedoms. The freedom to speak, the freedom to assemble, the freedom to involve ourselves in our own governance and the freedom to practice our religious beliefs whether in garb, in prayer or in wearing a simple rosary as a reminder of a lost loved one. Were the association a so-called “left-wing” outfit, I wonder if this newspaper would take on a different tone and attitude? I would have to again assume that they would.
Next enter Carl Strock and his column today about Raymond who he is now terming “rosary boy.” I can only guess that he’s comparing Raymond and his efforts to those of the “balloon boy” but he’s mixing up apples and lemons. The so-called “balloon boy” was set up by his parents (who were convicted of fraud by the way) whereas Raymond simply wants to wear his rosary freely and without harassment by the schools or this newspaper. Carl Strock (who I consider to be an angry atheist) even had the audacity to look up the kid’s Facebook page, talk to his teachers and even to the landlord of his mother. And the angry atheist put together a column with all that information, molesting this child and his ideas and causing further grief and anguish to this family.
But that’s what atheists do. They use circular logic, fifty cent words and carry about them an air of superiority such that the lowly folk out there can do nothing except be confused about what they say. Carl Strock, the Angry Atheist is fully supported by this newspaper but I have to figure that it’s only because they think he sells newspapers for them. Carl Strock is “News worth paying for” as Judy Patrick the managing editor stated once or twice in a couple of her own “signed” editorials.
Anyway, getting back to some of the comments made by Carl in his column today, he begins his column with:
Quoted Text Round 1 goes to the rosary boy and the Christian legal organization supporting him, and that should not be a surprise. When you disregard some colorful background and simply ask, Does a kid have a right to wear a necklace of rosary beads to school? it’s hard to answer no without running afoul of the First Amendment.
Yes, it is hard to answer anything but “no” when dealing with the First Amendment. So why on earth is Carl Strock, the Angry Atheist continuing with this theme? He then continues in the next paragraph with:
Quoted Text Never mind that the rosary is a distinctly Catholic object and that the kid wearing it in this case, Raymond Hosier Jr., age 13, of Schenectady, is not Catholic. Never mind also that Catholics do not wear the rosary as a necklace, bracelet or any other form of jewelry and many of them object to such use.
Never mind that Strock can turn on a dime, pitting one religion against another when it’s convenient for him to do so. Never mind that he has criticized the religious beliefs of the masses when it suits him or fits into an essay on his opinion of the stupidity of the common folk. Never mind that he’s trashing a boy with growing beliefs, beliefs that will mature and change as he grows. But what will be remembered most, by Ray Hosier, by his mother, family and friends, and by me is that Carl Strock is a bully in every sense of the word. He bullies people who have different ideas than his own, people who think differently or act differently or behave differently. Carl Strock appears to have the same kind of mentality that many cops have, except his “gun” is his typewriter and his targets are people with a different comprehension of the world around them, than his definition of the way things are. And like most cowards, Carl Strock hides behind his so-called extensive worldliness and education.
And to further prove his own tabloid-esq ability, Carl Strock writes that he spoke with the family’s former landlord who in turn gave subjective statements as to the quality and style of the family. People go to court for all kinds of reasons and I personally have experiences going to “eviction court.” But the Angry Atheist has automatically taken the side of landlord Mohammed Hossain because that fits right in with his theories of society and justice. Perhaps if the tables were turned, if Ray Hosier said that he was being discriminated against because he had a “Muslim” faith and beliefs, Carl Strock would be right there behind him, jacking him up for the world to see that he was the victim of injustice.
Last, there was a letter written to the editor published in today’s Daily Gazette by one Polly Windels of Ballston Spa titled “Student using rosaries for the wrong reasons.” And to that I must ask this question, how can a rosary worn by a boy in remembrance of his dead brother and his dead uncle be wrong? Even if he’s not “Catholic.” Even if he isn’t even the best and brightest kid on the block. Even if he comes from what many elitists consider being a “lower class” family.
How can wearing a rosary around your neck, a depiction of Jesus Christ nailed to a cross in a crucifixion in any way, shape or form be a wrong reason? As in the wisdom of “Desiderata”, written by Max Ehrmann in the 1920’s and “not” found in Old St. Paul’s Church, I say to Raymond Hosier:
Quoted Text You are a child of the universe no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be.
So be at peace with God Raymond, Chantell and all of your loved ones, and be at peace with yourselves.
Wearing of the Rosary, if this child was Catholic (not sure if he is Catholic or Christian) COULD be grounds for one of the 15 promises of the Blessed Virgin Mary
"To those who propagate my Rosary I promise aid in all their necessities."
That being said, the Hispanic Catholic community has a deep devotion to Our Lady of Guadalupe, and many believe in wearing the Rosary around the neck. I don't believe this child is Hispanic, though I could be mistaken.
Personally, I was always taught that wearing it around the neck, or as "jewelry", was disrespectful.
After thinking about this, and getting into several discussions about this, my personal feeling is that if he is a Catholic, it's being disrespectful. My stance on this has changed several times, I can see both sides of the "argument". That being said, it's clearly outlined in a list of items prohibited by the school. He has the right, under the Constitution to have the Rosary with him, Catholic/Christian or not, for whatever purpose he desires. However, it needs to be in accordance with the rules of the school district. I feel this is probably a "money grab" by the mother, bringing in the ACLU. Instead of teaching her child to respect the laws (wear it under his shirt), she's actually doing more harm than good.
An older Catholic friend of mine put it another way: "I feel that it would call too much attention to me, and that would defeat the purpose of wearing it. I think you are better off living your faith and not wearing it." Indeed, Pride/Vanity is one of the 7 deadly sins for Catholics.
I just did a Google search (on 7 deadly sins) and ironically found this:
Quoted Text
According to The Picture Book of Devils, Demons and Witchcraft, by Ernst and Johanna Lehner, each of the Sins was associated with a specific punishment in Hell. I once saw a set of 16th-century engravings by George Pencz that used animals in their depictions of the Sins. The prints also used women to symbolize all the Sins, which was probably okay in the sociopolitical climate of the 16th century but probably wouldn't be encouraged nowadays.
(* The pictures I've seen show him with 'purple' (violet) rosary beads)
Now, I've gotta agree with Pat 110% - Strock is TOTALLY exploiting this family and bullying this child and for no other reason than to make headlines and sell papers. The Daily Gazette should be ashamed of themselves for allowing this to continue.
After reading the June 3 article, “School sued after boy suspended for wearing rosary,” I was once again saddened to see how much has changed in the city I grew up in, right down to the middle school I attended 30 years ago. This type of problem is not limited to Schenectady, but that fact does nothing to ease Schenectady’s image. Of course, when you declare that, in your city, the odds are that rosary beads are worn as a gang symbol, that doesn’t help, either. How far are we, as a people, going to let ourselves sink? Enough parents are raising gang members that these gangs — these menaces to society — now dictate not only the clothing everyone’s children can wear in school but have superseded personal religious beliefs with this latest ban on rosary beads. We have to get back to common sense, decency and morality. If gang members are present in the schools and creating this level of fear, they must be removed. Instead of suspending a child for wearing rosary beads, shouldn’t we expel the gang members? ELIZABETH CATONE Barnegat, N.J. The writer is a former Schenectady resident.
Those interested, Raymond Hosier still has a public Facebook page.
Login to your Facebook account - search for "Raymond Hosier". It's public as of 9am Saturday 6/5
Quoted Text
Raymond Hosier im having a birthday party at central park on saturday at 2:00pm and all my friends better come well wish me luck thanxxxz May 21 at 11:55am
Raymond Hosier today iz my b-day 13 bby May 20 at 8:48am
Raymond Hosier yo i just got sent out of skool bcuz of wearing rosary beedz tht iz mad messed uhp May 17 at 12:38pm
What's with the "gang speak"?
Beedz? That doesn't sound very "religious" to me, but, as I said above, he should have the right to carry them according to the constitutional freedoms we all enjoy, but perhaps wearing them under his shirt, or carrying them in his pocket would be a better idea, IMHO.
If it is of any consolation, my 13 year old grandchildren are on facebook. They and their friends talk (type) the same way. They also text message the same way. Some of them don't even live in this area or attend any Schenectady County schools. The 20 somethings do the same. It must be the "new English".
Lawyers in bead case have no appreciation for reality
So, the American Center for Law and Justice says that the Schenectady schools’ dress code violates Raymond Hosier’s constitutional rights. It would be interesting to know if any of these lawyers have stepped foot in the high school lately, or whether they will be there when the fi rst fight breaks out because someone is wearing the wrong color. The school district has a great responsibility: to give our children the best education possible in a safe environment. So much time is spent trying to make it safe that education has taken a [back] seat. Talk to a teacher who works for Schenectady schools and ask them how much time they actually get to spend teaching and how much time they spend talking with counselors and Child Protective Services — you would be amazed. Let’s roll the clock back several years and put the focus where it belongs. These dress code policies didn’t exist until students started pushing the boundaries. My parents would not have let me leave the house with pants so low that my underwear was showing, or a shirt that would have been disruptive in class. Why? Because they had respect for my teachers and what they were doing. Some parents today do not have that same respect. So enough, already! Everyone has gotten their 15 minutes of fame out of the situation Put the rosaries inside your shirt and let’s get back to teaching our kids.
Logged
