I did. The unborn fetus is legally entitled to survivor benefits. How can a clump of cells receive be recognized an a legal person? If the father dies and has no children, why on gods green earth would a child born after death be recognized as his child? And if it has the legal rights to survivor benefits while in the womb, how can it be legal to purposely kill it to prevent its legal right to collect it?
Obviously a child BORN is entitled to survivor benefits. You seem surprised by this. If you are proven to be the father in a paternity lawsuit, you are responsible for support of that child.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Obviously a child BORN is entitled to survivor benefits. You seem surprised by this. If you are proven to be the father in a paternity lawsuit, you are responsible for support of that child.
First of all, your argument has always been a fertilized egg isn't a child.
Second, in this case the fertilized egg is entitled to benefits in the womb, they can't collect on the benefits until they get out of the womb. Just like you are entitled to social security retirement benefits now, but can't collect until you reach 65. There is no guarantee you will reach retirement age, but purposely killing a person at 64 doesn't mean they were never a person.
First of all, your argument has always been a fertilized egg isn't a child. Second, in this case the fertilized egg is entitled to benefits in the womb, they can't collect on the benefits until they get out of the womb. Just like you are entitled to social security retirement benefits now, but can't collect until you reach 65. There is no guarantee you will reach retirement age, but purposely killing a person at 64 doesn't mean they were never a person.
OK Cissy, Since you insist that a 'fertilized egg' has inheritance rights... and apparently those rights are the same as any other citizen... If a women becomes pregnant, and has a miscarriage, then that fetus has the same rights to the inheritance as all the rest of the 'fertilized eggs' she may produce.
How exactly does that fetus leave a will? Does his inheritance rights end because he dies? Can a fetus leave his share of an inheritance to others, say to his fellow future fetus?
If a fetus has inheritance rights, don't all the past 'fertilized eggs' of that couple share in the inheritance? Since most fertilized eggs never make it to be born... that could mean a only child would have to share his inheritance with dozens, or perhaps hundreds of diseased fertilized eggs and the courts would have to decide exactly who inherits their share of the wealth.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
OK Cissy, Since you insist that a 'fertilized egg' has inheritance rights... and apparently those rights are the same as any other citizen... If a women becomes pregnant, and has a miscarriage, then that fetus has the same rights to the inheritance as all the rest of the 'fertilized eggs' she may produce.
How exactly does that fetus leave a will? Does his inheritance rights end because he dies?
All these are mute points. Look at the heirs to the thrown on England. When Prince William fertilized an egg, that fertilized egg enherited the thrown, and if that egg was male, it was already determined that the egg it fertilizes next, that egg is entitled to the thrown, and so on and so forth.
In a Libertarian country, government enforced child support and survivor benefits would not exist.
Families and friends would take care of these kinds of issues.
Grandma should be living in the back room, not dumped on the government and place in a government paid group home.
Americans are becoming totally dependent on the government taking care of them.
The government embraces it as it takes control of every aspect of your life.
I agree. But the point of my whole premise was to use the current statist governments argument that box uses to claim a fertilized egg is not a person, when that same statist system recognizes that fertilized eggs right to the statist entitlement, but can only collect once born. Abortion prevents the fertilized egg from collecting the entitlements statists agree it has a right to.
And before you go into your argument about government can't grant rights - I agree. The point of the argument was to illustrate the statists flawed argument about when a person receives legal recognition. And in this example, it is at the point if fertilization.
I agree. But the point of my whole premise was to use the current statist governments argument that box uses to claim a fertilized egg is not a person, when that same statist system recognizes that fertilized eggs right to the statist entitlement, but can only collect once born. Abortion prevents the fertilized egg from collecting the entitlements statists agree it has a right to.
And before you go into your argument about government can't grant rights - I agree. The point of the argument was to illustrate the statists flawed argument about when a person receives legal recognition. And in this example, it is at the point if fertilization.
A man is liable for child support immediately after conception.
A woman should not be allowed to abort the man's future child without consent.
Men have no rights to the fertilized egg?
Even corporations have rights to genetically engineered life forms.
I think there are better ways to slow the abortion rates than by arguing when life begins.
Your issue is not with the definitions or the laws, it is with the staggering numbers of abortions.
Arguing the definitions and laws will not change the numbers.
Finding alternatives to abortion will in fact reduce the numbers of abortions.
If adoption agencies ran abortion clinics, there would be drastic reductions in the numbers. They would work hard to make better profits by brokering the adoptions, than from abortions.
The entire abortion issue is caused by people accepting government issued moral values, replacing real family values, through all types of legislation. The source of the abortion issue must be addressed. Stopping the government from issuing behavior standards and values is the first step.
Even if you made it illegal to have an abortion, people would simply fly to Canada for $200 and get it done for free in their socialized medicine system.
Legislation is a failure. Arguing it won't change a thing.
All these are mute points. Look at the heirs to the thrown on England. When Prince William fertilized an egg, that fertilized egg enherited the thrown, and if that egg was male, it was already determined that the egg it fertilizes next, that egg is entitled to the thrown, and so on and so forth.
OK this is Cicero's Reality:
Ladies and Gentlemen, meet the king of England
(It's gonna get pretty messy if they do that "sword on the shoulder thing"!)
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
This is Cicero's Reality: Ladies and Gentlemen, Meet Your Plumber. His name is Bob, and he's here to fix the leaky pipes.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
It's not a human, it does not have legal recognition in court of law. For those that don't understand rhetorical debate, this is called a false analogy. Good try box.
This is Cicero's Reality: Ladies and Gentlemen, Meet Your Plumber. His name is Bob, and he's here to fix the leaky pipes.
Yes, this plumber is entitled to social security survivor benefits RIGHT NOW, and he'll collect them when he gets out of the womb. I hope nobody goes in and kills him to deny his right to those benefits.
And he inherits the thrown once born.(hopefully nobody denies him the right by aborting)
Note... ONCE BORN! Until then, what may or may not end up being the King of England is only a tiny blob of cells.
This is Cicero's price chicken. The "chicken's" name is Humpty Dumpty!
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Yes, this plumber is entitled to social security survivor benefits RIGHT NOW, and he'll collect them when he gets out of the womb. I hope nobody goes in and kills him to deny his right to those benefits.
Sorry Cicero. I made a mistake. It's easy to do but the plumber... He's really a goat. Zygotes kind of all look a like at this stage. Human, Goat, Pig, Chimp??? Hard to tell.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Logged
He's really a goat. 
