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Schalmont Looks To Close Elementary Schools
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ROTTERDAM
Closing a school among district options

BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter

    Closing or reconfiguring elementary schools, changing attendance zones, moving the fifth grade to the middle school/high school campus or doing nothing at all are among options to improve efficiency a consultant has suggested in a report provided to Schalmont Central School District offi cials.
    The Board of Education last December hired Paul Seversky of Advisory Solutions to look at the district’s space needs and enrollment trends to see how it could deliver its educational services more cost effectively.
    School officials stressed that no decisions have been made. The next step is a series of community forums that will be announced shortly.
    “There is much to consider but we need to work together as a community to determine what is best for the children and taxpayers of Schalmont,” Schools Superintendent Valerie Kelsey said, reading from a prepared statement at Monday’s meeting where the board accepted the report. “The study will serve as a tool to help guide those conversations.”
    Kelsey said afterward that the board would like to reach a decision by February so it can incorporate the changes into budget planning.
    The district planned to have the report on its website at http://www.schalmont.org.
    Driving much of the discussion is the district’s declining enrollment, which has dropped by about 350 students in the last fi ve years and currently stands at 1,951. At the same time, the district has cut about 10 percent of its staff, Kelsey said.
    “We’ve worked very hard to have good programs for our children and we want to make sure we continue to do that,” she said.
    The poor economy combined with reduced state aid is also causing the district to look for ways to cut costs.
    “Our school population is declining but taxes are ever present,” said board member Robert Sheehan. “I would hope that much more community residents get involved in the discussions on this topic because it’s your and the kids’ future.”
    Seversky visited district schools and talked with school offi cials as well as real estate professionals and municipal officials to get a sense of what is happening with growth in the region.
    He outlined six scenarios in his report, which cost the district $25,000. Many of them would affect Mariaville and Woestina elementaries, the district’s two smallest schools with 97 and 116 students, respectively. Each school currently only has one section of each grade level.
    Scenario A would maintain the status quo. Scenario B would combine the Mariaville and Woestina attendance zones into one. One facility would serve grades kindergarten through second and the other third through fi fth.
    Scenario C would close either Mariaville or Woestina, and the remaining facility would become a K-2 school. Grades three, four and five would go to Jefferson Elementary.
    Scenario D would move grade five pupils districtwide to the middle and high school building. It would combine the Mariaville and Woestina attendance zones into one and use one of those schools to serve K-2, while closing the other. Grades three and four would go to Jefferson.
    Scenario E would close either Mariaville or Woestina and redraw the attendance zones so that 129 pupils attend the remaining school. The others would go to Jefferson. Grade five could also be housed at the main campus under this option.
    Scenario F would close both small schools and send grades K-4 to Jefferson with grade five at the middle/high school campus.
    School officials could also create a Scenario G by mixing and matching the options.
    Seversky wrote in the report that the district has additional capacity at the middle and high school campus to accommodate 340 more students. Jefferson Elementary is nearly at capacity and could only accommodate about eight more students. ..............>>>>....................>>>>.................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r00902&AppName=1
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ROTTERDAM
Mariaville, Woestina schools fear closure talks
BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter
Reach Gazette reporter Michael Goot at 395-3105 or mgoot@dailygazette.net.

    Mariaville Elementary School PTO members don’t know if they should order hats with the school’s name on them.
    Next year, there might not be school. Under a district reconfiguration plan being considered, four out of the six options involve closing Woestina or Mariaville — the district’s two smallest schools with 116 and 97 students, respectively. One option involves closing both schools. Both were renovated six years ago.
    In various scenarios, the remaining smaller school would pick up the students from the school that closes. Other students would be sent to Jefferson Elementary. School offi cials would like to reach a decision by February so they can incorporate changes into budget planning.
    Following discussion of upcoming movie nights and fundraisers, parents at Tuesday’s Mariaville PTO meeting were concerned about the future of their school.
    “I don’t want my child going on the bus in the winter,” said parent Jeanette Ray. “I don’t want her on the bus for 45 minutes or whatever it would take to go to Jefferson. ..................>>>>...............>>>>.................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r01203&AppName=1
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Quoted Text
ROTTERDAM
Mariaville school parents question plan

BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter
Reach Gazette reporter Michael Goot at 395-3105 or mgoot@dailygazette.net.

    Mariaville Elementary parents are upset about a combined fi rst and second grade class this year and the fact that the school may close entirely next year under a Schalmont school district reorganization proposal.
    School officials have scheduled a series of community forums to discuss the report of Advisory Solutions, which recommended various options for closing one or both of the district’s smaller elementary schools — Mariaville and Woestina.
    The district commissioned the study to fi nd out how to improve efficiency in the wake of rising costs, declining enrollment and decreasing state aid.
    The first forum will take place at 7 p.m. Oct. 13 beginning with a presentation in the middle school/ high school auditorium followed by discussion in the high school cafeteria. The same presentation will occur on Oct. 14 at the same time and place. There will be roundtable discussions on Nov. 3 and Nov. 16 at 7 p.m. in the high school cafeteria and Dec. 13 at 6 p.m. in the middle school cafeteria.
    Residents had a more immediate concern at Monday’s Board of Education meeting — the class at Mariaville, which was combined this year because of a budget cut. ................>>>>.................>>>>....................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r01001&AppName=1
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http://www.schalmont.org/District/news/1011/efficiencystudy/SCSDnewsletter_oct10.pdf

More information on this topic at the above listed link.

Quoted Text
Difficult decisions on the horizon
Declining enrollment and state aid among challenges facing district
Because the majority of a school’s budget goes to paying salaries and benefits, the most significant way to trim the budget is through more efficient use of its staff, Kellet added.
To prepare students to compete in a global marketplace the district needs to effectively use its resources and focus on the community’s highest priorities, according to Kelsey.
“We’re at the point where there’s not much left to cut without adversely affecting the successful educational programs we’ve worked so hard on creating over the years,” said Kelsey.
The educational landscape in New York is changing; students are faced with new national standards and more rigorous assessments all designed to ensure they are prepared for college and a 21st century-workforce where critical thinking, creativity, collaboration and excellent communication skills are vital to their success.
Now, more than ever, Schalmont must maximize its resources and its commitment to providing all students with a high-quality education at a reasonable cost. “It’s become clear the state is no longer a reliable funding source.”
When revenue from the state decreases, schools have to reduce expenditures or increase funding from their other main revenue source—local taxpayers.
Schalmont’s Board of Education has worked on controlling the amount of the tax levy increase each year to mitigate the impact on taxpayers. This has been made possible by bringing staffing levels in line with declining enrollment through reductions. Other reductions have also been made to athletic and extracurricular programs, equipment, supplies and field trips. Last year alone, the district made $1.5 million in spending cuts. [A complete list of cuts is available online.]
The district continues to explore ways to control costs and reduce spending to limit tax levy increases. For example, the district’s energy conservation program has saved approximately $430,000 since 2008.
Although the district maintains a sufficient undesignated fund balance, district officials believe it would be irresponsible to use all of these “rainy-day” funds to make up for cuts in state aid.
“If we use up our fund balance, we won’t have it going forward,” said Business Administrator Mark Kellet. “It would be irresponsible to use a one-time payment to solve problems that are going to come back year after year. We need to reduce costs to match our sources of revenue.”
Faced with declining enrollment, decreasing state aid and rising operating costs, the Schalmont Central School District is at a critical crossroads.
District enrollment has been declining steadily, particularly over the past five years during which enrollment dropped 11 percent—from 2,182 students to 1,951 today; by 2019, enrollment is projected to drop to as low as 1,600 to 1,800.
The effect of declining enrollment has created less than ideal situations, such as class-size inequity among buildings and combined grade levels in some schools.
Further exacerbating the situation is state education funding, which has been dropping year after year. Experts predict New York state’s fiscal crisis will continue for years to come, and public schools can expect future cuts to state aid.
“This is one of the most challenging financial times our state has ever faced,” said Superintendent Dr. Valerie Kelsey.
“It’s become clear the state is no longer a reliable funding source.”
When revenue from the state decreases, schools have to reduce expenditures or increase funding from their other main revenue source—local taxpayers.
Schalmont’s Board of Education has worked on controlling the amount of the tax levy increase each year to mitigate the impact on taxpayers. This has been made possible by bringing staffing levels in line with declining enrollment through reductions. Other reductions have also been made to athletic and extracurricular programs, equipment, supplies and field trips. Last year alone, the district made $1.5 million in spending cuts. [A complete list of cuts is available online.]
The district continues to explore ways to control costs and reduce spending to limit tax levy increases. For example, the district’s energy conservation program has saved approximately $430,000 since 2008.
Although the district maintains a sufficient undesignated fund balance, district officials believe it would be irresponsible to use all of these “rainy-day” funds to make up for cuts in state aid.
“If we use up our fund balance, we won’t have it going forward,” said Business Administrator Mark Kellet. “It would be irresponsible to use a one-time payment to solve problems that are going to come back year after year. We need to reduce costs to match our sources of revenue.”
Because the majority of a school’s budget goes to paying salaries and benefits, the most significant way to trim the budget is through more efficient use of its staff, Kellet added.
To prepare students to compete in a global marketplace the district needs to effectively use its resources and focus on the community’s highest priorities, according to Kelsey.
“We’re at the point where there’s not much left to cut without adversely affecting the successful educational programs we’ve worked so hard on creating over the years,” said Kelsey.
The educational landscape in New York is changing; students are faced with new national standards and more rigorous assessments all designed to ensure they are prepared for college and a 21st century-workforce where critical thinking, creativity, collaboration and excellent communication skills are vital to their success.
Now, more than ever, Schalmont must maximize its resources and its commitment to providing all students with a high-quality education at a reasonable cost.
Difficult decisions are on the horizon, and the entire community is going to be vital to the decision-making process.
“We are facing some difficult choices—maintain the status quo and accept future tax levy increases, make additional cuts to academic and extracurricular programming and staff or explore structural changes, both inside our classrooms and to our school buildings,” said Kelsey.
To that end, a series of discussions will be held throughout the fall and winter as a way to engage the community in conversations about their values, priorities and sacrifices they’re willing to make.
“There will be no easy answers, and everyone will likely feel a pinch, but it is our responsibility to begin these difficult conversations now,” said Kelsey. “The challenges before us are severe, but I’m confident that, by working together, we’ll emerge from this period stronger and more efficient with the ability to provide programming that meets all student’s needs.”


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From the same link as my last post.

Quoted Text
Efficiency study outlines possible options for consideration
Community input vital to decision-making process
A study outlining a variety of options to more efficiently deliver Schalmont’s kindergarten through twelfth-grade program will be the focus of roundtable discussions open to the community this fall and winter (see page 4 for dates).
The options range from maintaining the status quo to closing a school or schools and combining attendance zones among other configurations (see chart below).
The study, completed by Advisory Solutions—a consultant group created by the New York State School Boards Association—identifies the advantages and challenges associated with each option.
District officials are currently reviewing the financial implications of each, and will share that data as it becomes available.
According to the study’s author, Dr. Paul M. Seversky, enrollment projections, analysis of school building capacity levels and program delivery in those facilities formed the rationale for each suggestion. He also took into consideration the values and policies guiding the district’s vision and its long-range planning efforts.
Ultimately, the goal of the study was to identify options the district, board and community could further explore together.
“The district’s leadership team has knowledge of the district’s history, its culture and the preferences held by school district stakeholders,” said Seversky. “They are ultimately responsible, and most able to determine, with community engagement, which delivery option, adapted option or set of options for the future will be best to deliver instruction.”
According to the report, all schools are operating well under capacity and can accommodate enrollment shifts. Currently all three elementary schools enroll kindergarten through fifth-graders, but orgtwo of the schools are operating substantially under capacity. This is true at the middle/high school as well.
“There is much to consider, but we must work together as a community to decide what’s best for our students and taxpayers,” said Superintendent Dr. Valerie Kelsey. “These are only potential options at this point, and the board is not bound to any one of them, nor have they agreed to move forward in any specific direction.”
At this point, district officials are waiting to gauge feedback from the community on what’s most important to them before they begin narrowing down the options.
“It’s likely some of the options will be dismissed rather quickly as not the right solution for our community,” said Kelsey. “However, we want our community to be fully aware of and engaged in the process right from the beginning. We will reach those decisions together.”
The entire community—students, parents, grandparents, staff, taxpayers and business owners—are encouraged to get involved, provide input and discuss the challenges ahead.
Declining enrollment and a variety of financial challenges prompted the Board of Education to commission the efficiency study in Dec. 2009. The completed report was presented to the board at its meeting on Sept. 13, 2010, and made available to the public immediately preceding that meeting. It is available on the district website.


Summary of options up for discussion

Scenario A:
Maintain the status quo, by continuing the current pattern of delivery.
Scenario B:
Combine Mariaville and Woestina attendance zones into one. Serve kindergarten to second grade at one building and third through fifth at the other or vice versa.
Scenario C:
Close Mariaville or Woestina. The remaining facility would become a kindergarten through second grade school. Grades three through five would go to Jefferson.
Scenario D:
Move fifth-graders districtwide to the middle/high school campus. Combine Mariaville and Woestina attendance zones into one and use one of the schools to serve kindergarten to second grade while closing the other. Grades three through four would go to Jefferson.
Scenario E:
Close Mariaville or Woestina and redraw attendance zones so that 129 students attend the remaining school. The other students would go to Jefferson. Fifth-graders could also be housed at the middle/high school campus.
Scenario F:
Close both Mariaville and Woestina and send kindergarten through fourth-graders to Jefferson and move fifth-graders to the middle/high school campus.
Scenario G:
Consider an alternative solution or mix and match the options listed above.


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Q&A at the same link:
Quoted Text


Q&A about the efficiency study

What is the purpose of the efficiency study?
The efficiency study was designed to gather data on delivery of the district’s kindergarten through twelfth-grade program to determine more efficient ways to deliver services at a reasonable cost.

Why was the study conducted?
For several years, the Board of Education has made long-range financial planning one of its annual goals. In light of a steady decline in enrollment, rising costs and threats of mid-year state funding cuts, in Dec. 2009, the board felt it prudent and necessary to conduct the study as a means of finding possible opportunities for savings.

Who conducted the study?
District officials felt it was critical to have an independent, neutral party, conduct an objective review of the district’s services. To that end, Advisory Solutions, a consultant group operated by the New York State School Boards Association, conducted the study.

What did the study analyze?
The study reviewed pupil capacity; space utilization in the district’s five school buildings and estimated future enrollment trends based on historical enrollment data, historical live data and patterns of enrollment at each grade level. This was done while considering the values and policies that guide the vision of the district and its long-range planning efforts.

What were the results of the study?
The study identified a variety of potential options to more efficiently deliver the district’s educational program while outlining the opportunities and challenges associated with each.

What are the cost savings per option?
District officials are currently reviewing the cost implications of each potential option and will share those findings during the upcoming discussions.

Is the study available publicly?
Yes. The complete 174-page report is available on the district website. Hard copies are also available for viewing in each school’s main offices and at the public library. Community members are encouraged to read the entire report, digest its contents and be prepared to voice their opinions, concerns and suggestions during the upcoming discussions.

Has a decision been reached?
No. The study was designed to serve as a tool to help guide conversations with the community. A decision will not be reached until feedback has been gathered.

Will there be a public vote?
No, the Board of Education will reach a decision in mid to late January based, in part, on the feedback it receives from the community during roundtable discussions scheduled throughout the fall and winter. The discussions are designed to engage the entire community in conversations regarding the study’s findings and their implementation. Any potential changes will be incorporated into budget planning for the 2011-12 school year.

How can I learn more?
Attend the upcoming roundtable discussions. During the Oct. 13 and 14 sessions, specific findings from the study will be shared by Advisory Solutions. All information pertaining to the study and roundtable discussions will also be made available on the district website at http://www.schalmont.org. To further keep the community informed and engaged throughout the discussions, the district has joined Facebook and Twitter. Information will also be available via the district’s opt-in news service, School News Notifier, local media outlets and other communication vehicles, as appropriate.v


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ROTTERDAM
District mulls costs, closure
BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter

    Closing smaller schools, mixing fifth-graders in with older students and increasing taxes were on the minds of the almost 100 residents who attended the Schalmont Central School District’s fi rst community roundtable at the high school Wednesday to discuss potential consolidation of buildings.
    The district is considering closing one or both of its smaller elementary schools, Mariaville and Woestina, in the wake of declining enrollment, decreasing state aid and rising costs.
    Residents first heard from Superintendent Valerie Kelsey, who laid out a stark picture of the district’s fiscal situation. If the district changes no programs, its 2011-12 budget will be $43.9 million — $1.7 million higher than this year — given increases in health and retirement costs.
    Consultant Paul Seversky of Advisory Solutions said enrollment is flat in the district. There is some existing housing stock that could bring in more families if “empty nesters” sell their homes and new residents arrive. An economic development boom could also increase enrollment. However, his projection is that kindergarten through fifth-grade enrollment will likely decrease by between 70 and 110 pupils during the next fi ve years; grades six to eight will decrease by about 20 pupils over the next eight years; and grades nine through 12 will decrease by 90 to 110 students during the next decade. Enrollment could drop from 1,950 currently to between 1,800 and 1,876. ..........................>>>>......................>>>>........................................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r01304&AppName=1
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Quoted Text
ROTTERDAM
Forum will address possible closing of schools
BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter

    The Schalmont Central School District could save almost $1.5 million next year if it closed its two smallest elementary schools, according to a district analysis.
    School officials are currently studying various options presented by consultant Paul Seversky of Advisory Solutions for reconfi guring its K-12 program. The latest in a series of community forums to discuss the issue will be held tonight at 7 p.m. in the Schalmont High School auditorium. To RSVP for the session or for more information, visit http://www. schalmont.org.
    Both Woestina and Mariaville have about 100 students each. District officials put the cost to operate Woestina at $1.1 million in 2011-12 and Mariaville at just over $1 million. One option would be to close both and would send kindergarten through fourth-grade students to Jefferson Elementary and grade five to the middle and high school campus.
    Costs of $20,000 for Woestina and $11,000 for Mariaville would remain in the district’s budget to maintain the vacated buildings. Transportation costs would go up about $91,000 and there would be about $500,000 spent to accommodate the students in an area of the middle/high school building, leaving a net savings of about $1.5 million. ...............>>>>.............................>>>>...................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r01502&AppName=1
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Schalmont schools future to be topic
    ROTTERDAM — The last community meeting regarding options to close or reconfi gure Schalmont schools will be held tonight.
    The event will take place at 6 p.m. in the Schalmont Middle School cafeteria before the 7 p.m. Board of Education meeting.
    School officials are considering several options to close or reconfigure schools in order to address rising costs, decreasing state aid and declining enrollment. Several of the options involve closing one or both of the Mariaville and Woestina schools, the district’s two smallest elementary schools. Some options include sending fi fth-graders to the middle and high school campus.
    This meeting will give an overview of the community feedback received at a series of roundtable discussions held throughout the fall. District officials will address questions previously raised and explain the next step in the process. Unlike the last sessions, there will not be small group discussions.
    The board is expected to make a decision regarding the scenarios by mid-February so school offi - cials can incorporate the changes into planning for the 2011-12 year budget.
    To register to attend and for more information, visit http://www. schalmont.org or call 355-9200, ext. 4006.

http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r00800&AppName=1
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ROTTERDAM
School closure highly likely
BY MICHAEL GOOT Gazette Reporter

    Schalmont Central School District residents who attended community forums on school consolidation seem resigned to the fact that one or both of the district’s two smallest elementary schools — Mariaville and Woestina — will have to be closed, the district said.
    Doing nothing is not an option, according to the feedback.
    “There was a general understanding we can’t keep doing what we’re doing both programmatically and structurally with the costs that are increasing,” said Superintendent Valerie Kelsey.
    The board plans to make a decision in mid-February, by which time the district hopes to have a better idea of how much state aid it will get next year.
    Although people like the programs the schools offer, Kelsey said the strong consensus is that taxes are too high. In the wake of declining state aid, increasing health insurance and retirement costs and flat enrollment, changes are necessary, accoring to feedback.
    Assuming state aid will be flat, Kelsey estimates that the current $42.3 million budget would increase by 7 or 8 percent just with increases in salaries, health insurance and pension contributions.
    That is too much for the community to bear, according to Board of Education President Kevin Thompson. .............>>>>................>>>>...................http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r00903&AppName=1
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ROTTERDAM
Official: 2 schools should be closed

Superintendent says shutting 1 won’t save enough
BY KATHLEEN MOORE Gazette Reporter

    A proposal to close two of Schalmont’s elementary schools has left some parents furious — and others resigned to what they say is an inescapable reality.
    “I don’t know what other choice they have,” said Woestina Elementary School PTO Secretary Jodi Decker. “Considering the salary increases for the teachers, the increase for retirement, the state’s not giving them the money they used to get … .”
    For all of those reasons, Superintendent Valerie Kelsey has recommended that the district close Woestina and Mariaville at the end of the school year. The move will save nearly $1.5 million.
The district will still have to cut another $1 million in the 2011-12 budget, Kelsey said. Parents at Woestina said the news was heartbreaking. “I’m devastated,” said PTO President Susan Ryder. “I absolutely do not want to see Woestina close.” But she, like Decker, thinks nothing can be done.
    “We think it’s inevitable,” she said. “We’re going to focus on making the transition for our kids.”
    She wants to schedule events with children from Mariaville and Jefferson, the only elementary school that would remain open under Kelsey’s plan.
    Joint events would help create the new community of parents and children, Ryder said. It would also help children adapt to the new school by introducing them to their classmates and teachers.
    “Especially the younger kids, who are going to be swallowed up by the halls of Jefferson. On the first day of school, we want them to see a familiar face,” she said.
    But parents at Mariaville Elementary School may fight the decision.
    “They’re taking away our community. It’s all we have out here,” said PTO Vice President Cindy McKeon. “Why can’t you leave one school open? There’s got to be another solution.” ...................>>>>...............>>>>.............http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r00901&AppName=1
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Bad idea --- Schalmont closing buildings when Mohonasen wants a multi-million dollar bond issue to build more buildings and class space.

When will the taxpayers say enough is enough -- and demand that the 6 school districts in the county be
merged into a single school district  ????????????????????????????????????????

There is more than enough classroom space and other space in all of the various school districts' buildings
to EFFICIENTLY house all of the administration, support staff, teachers and students ---- it is just a question ofusing what aready exists in a more cost effective manner.


George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016
Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]

"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground."
Lyndon Baines Johnson
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Bad idea --- Schalmont closing buildings when Mohonasen wants a multi-million dollar bond issue to build more buildings and class space.

When will the taxpayers say enough is enough -- and demand that the 6 school districts in the county be
merged into a single school district  ????????????????????????????????????????

There is more than enough classroom space and other space in all of the various school districts' buildings
to EFFICIENTLY house all of the administration, support staff, teachers and students ---- it is just a question ofusing what aready exists in a more cost effective manner.


The taxpayers already said enough is enough, in the REMS vote and that other Mohon vote.   You say bad idea to close schools, but you cheer for wild spending of tax dollars on gin mills, bakeries, hair do salons, theaters, and OTHER NON ESSENTIALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BIGGEST HYPOCRITE ON THESE BOARDS

Of course, no job, not paying taxes, and living off the taxpayer dole


Optimists close their eyes and pretend problems are non existent.  
Better to have open eyes, see the truths, acknowledge the negatives, and
speak up for the people rather than the politicos and their rich cronies.
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DemocraticVoiceOfReason
January 29, 2011, 1:25pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from mikechristine1

The taxpayers already said enough is enough, in the REMS vote and that other Mohon vote.   You say bad idea to close schools, but you cheer for wild spending of tax dollars on gin mills, bakeries, hair do salons, theaters, and OTHER NON ESSENTIALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BIGGEST HYPOCRITE ON THESE BOARDS

Of course, no job, not paying taxes, and living off the taxpayer dole



You are the biggest liar on this website --  I pay taxes ... I have NEVER collected any money from the taxpayer dole and  I am quite comfortable from the good investments that I have made.

So take your lies and shove them up your backside.

When you grow up and can have a reasonable SANE conversation -- then I might consider having a discussion with you.  Until then -- go bugger yourself.


George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016
Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]

"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground."
Lyndon Baines Johnson
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MobileTerminal
January 29, 2011, 1:29pm Report to Moderator
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Sales tax doesn't count. Even renters (not boarders) pay sales tax.
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