It seems to me that the reason the state Department of Transportation favors roundabouts is that they limit accidents by allowing traffic to flow, albeit slowly, in places where there is a hard stop such as at a traffic signal. So if you look at Erie Boulevard, which intersections do you find have the biggest tie-ups and stop-and-go problems? State, Liberty, Union and Nott streets, and Maxon Road. State, Liberty and Union are much too close to each other for a single roundabout, so we would be better off with synchronized traffic signals. Nott Street and Maxon Road Extension would be somewhat ideal, and perhaps the reopening of the Maxon Road Extension outlet from the new Price Chopper headquarters would be workable. Those locations make sense. Everyone knows why the mayor wants the roundabout on nearly unused Church Street, and that is to get rid of two taxpaying businesses. But why spend the money there for something that will control non-existent side road traffic and most likely ruin several other businesses when the need for it in the first place is murky? If you have to have a roundabout because it is the in thing, use it where it is needed. ANDREW KOPACH Rotterdam
Carl Strock THE VIEW FROM HERE Roundabout battle over Erie Blvd. Carl Strock can be reached at 395-3085 or by e-mail at carlstrock@dailygazette.com.
If you want to know if I support traffic circles, or roundabouts as they are often called, I am going to beg off, taking due note of the fact that many people detest them. They detest them getting off Exit 12 of the Northway, where a traveler is apt to get dizzy before finding his way, and they detest them preemptively in Schenectady, on Erie Boulevard, where one is contemplated but not yet built. They really hate them there, or at least the Erie Boulevard business owners do, figuring that the one proposed for the middle of the stretch between State Street and the GE plant will impede drivers from crossing from one side of the street to the other and thus reduce business. The opponents run the social gamut from Jim Burhrmaster of the First National Bank of Scotia family, who says, “A roundabout will kill us, it will put us out of business,” referring to the branch of the bank at the lower end of Erie, to Rocco Palmer, proprietor of Schenectady’s most prominent pornography emporium, Another World, which would need to be demolished to make way for the roundabout. At a gathering of roundabout opponents at Brandon’s Restaurant the other night, on Van Vranken Avenue, I suggested to Palmer that perhaps the roundabout was proposed for that precise location in order to get rid of him, seeing as how his business is a disreputable one, and he said indignantly, “When they hand out condoms to 13-yearolds in school, you’re talking about a bookstore? C’mon!” It wouldn’t only be the porn shop, it would also be the gun shop next door, co-owned by a Schenectady cop. That’s Rocco’s building too, rented to the cop, Mark LaViolette. The roundabout would displace them both, which Schenectady’s city fathers might not regard as a huge cultural loss. I do note that the displacement, if it happens, would complete a process begun a few years ago, when City Hall tried to rid the city of porn shops and after a long legal battle finally struck a deal with Palmer, allowing him to keep the store on Erie Boulevard in exchange for getting rid of another one he owned on Upper State Street, which he did. Now the city finds a means, perhaps, to get him off Erie Boulevard also, thus negating that part of the deal. Actually, it wouldn’t be that big a change, since Palmer owns another building on Lower Broadway, properly zoned, that he is prepared to move his business into if need be. After 38 years, I guess he’s got a pretty good customer base. “It pays the bills,” he says modestly. As for redesigning the unwelcoming asphalt expanse of Erie Boulevard, Palmer says he plans to attend the City Council meeting tomorrow night. “I’m gonna say, forget Erie Boulevard. Why don’t we dig it up and put the canal back in. We can have waterfront property. Boats in the summer, skating in the winter. People will come downtown for that.” In his own way, he is a visionary. My understanding is that a large number of businesspeople plan to attend the meeting and make known their feelings about this roundabout business. They have even hired a lawyer to advance their case and to take whatever legal action might be indicated. I plan to stay out of it myself and keep my own counsel, though I confess I like the idea of restoring the old Erie Canal. The gun shop and the porn shop could have docks out front to welcome waterborne shoppers, maybe.
SCHENECTADY Council wants project changed Businesses balk at Erie Blvd. plan BY KATHLEEN MOORE Gazette Reporter
Five of the seven City Council members called for changes to the Erie Boulevard development plan Monday, citing the vehement protests of nearly every business owner on the street. Councilwoman Barbara Blanchard argued that the council had to take into consideration the business owners’ concerns. “They stayed with us when we were down and out,” she said. “Now that we’re making a rebound, we have to listen to them.” Councilman Gary McCarthy criticized the mayor’s handling of the project, saying it has become so controversial that the city has lost any good will it might have generated for rejuvenating the streetscape. “We’ve lost that opportunity for an exciting, happy project,” he said, adding that changes must be made before the council will support it. The council has the final say on whether the $14 million project goes forward. Council members must make a decision soon. Work is scheduled to start in 2009 and finish in 2011. They spoke after eight business owners railed about the project at Monday’s City Council meeting, arguing that it would jeopardize their livelihoods. “We’ve got everything at stake here,” said Alan Holet, owner of Precision Graphics. “I’ve been here 23 years. I’d like to know if I’m going to have a job. Am I going to be able to get people in and out of my office?” Another business owner, Sabrina Heilmann of AFLAC, pleaded, “Just talk with us. These businesses have withstood the GE downsizing … and now it seems upsetting that out government is putting in a plan to put these business out.” The project would place landscaped medians in the center of the boulevard, from State Street to I-890, and a roundabout near the adult bookstore. Business owners believe those features would make it nearly impossible for customers to get to a store if they were driving on the opposite side of the street. The roundabout would also force two businesses to relocate; to make space, the city would use eminent domain to demolish the adult bookstore and the next-door gun shop. Bookstore owner Rocco Palmer organized his fellow business owners to fight the roundabout when he learned of the plan. Councilman Joseph Allen is solidly on Palmer’s side. “We don’t have that many businesses in the city of Schenectady as it is. We don’t need to run anybody away,” Allen said. “I would have some real concerns about running away one business.” He said he would only support a project designed to help businesses thrive and expand, and categorically refused to support a project aimed solely at beautification. Councilman Thomas Della Sala said he also wants the business owners to be helped, not harmed, by the plan. “It is my sincere hope over the next few months as the plan evolves, your concerns are met,” he told the assembled business owners. Councilman Mark Blanchfield assured them that there is still time to change the plan, although he made no promises to make the changes they want. “I think it’s time to make sure we have all the input we need to make the right decision,” he said. Council President Margaret King did not address the crowd, and Councilwoman Denise Brucker was absent. Mayor Brian U. Stratton said the business owners will be pleased by the next version of the plan, which will be presented in mid-September. The only other public presentation was last November, when the project was revealed. “They haven’t had the benefit of seeing the plan,” Stratton said. “The plan hanging downstairs is not the current plan. I don’t know if they will all by satisfied, but they will have more information. It will be impossible to make every individual 100 percent happy, but we can make 95 percent of them happy.”
“We don’t have that many businesses in the city of Schenectady as it is. We don’t need to run anybody away,” Allen said. “I would have some real concerns about running away one business.”
Well, well....this is the very FIRST time I have finally heard someone from the city council or anyone else in Schenectady County politics actually state that "we don't have many businesses in the city of Schenectady as it is".
Now if that is true...where has all of our tax dollars gone in the last decade through the Metroplex Authority? Surely not for businesses. It clearly appears that the Metroplex is in the construction/rehab business only. And it is also evident that the present political leaders actually could care less about business! It sure as heck appears that the only businesses that the Plex is interested in is giving construction/rehab jobs to already existing contractors. And only the 'select few'.
When the INSANE are running the ASYLUM In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
“How fortunate for those in power that people never think.” Adolph Hitler
I drive in both directions frequently on Erie Boulevard, and don’t understand why we need a big rotary in the middle of the boulevard between State Street and Edison Avenue. I see many cars heading away from State Street making left turns near the old Wolberg store and the old union building, and evening GE traffic makes many left turns onto the street just past the gas station. Why do we need such a big rotary that doesn’t get you to the end of the boulevard? Traffic engineers should be able to design a safe rotary and/or a safe left/U-turn lane in the wide expanse of the existing boulevard that should solve most of the complaints being registered by businesses and others. GERARD F. HAVASY Scotia
Enough of the roundabout on Erie Boulevard! When planning for changes to the former canal, now a wide expanse of a street, the first order of business should be to guarantee the safety of the pedestrians who have to cross it. I recently had a number of errands to run, and in the interests of saving gas and trying to be environmentally friendly, I parked my car in a lot and decided to walk. All was well until I had to cross Erie Boulevard at State Street. Talk about taking your life in your hands! I followed directions and waited for a walk light to come on, but trust me, even when you see that little white stick figure beckoning you to proceed, your heart is not filled with confidence that you will make it across alive. Actually, it could have been worse. I watched as a woman, pushing a stroller, accompanied by four little children, scrambled across. It’s no wonder the businesses on the west side of Erie feel like poor stepchildren. You can’t get to them! CHRISTINE WITKOWSKI Scotia
Road alternative being advocated Businesses seek change in Erie Blvd. roundabout plans Kathleen Moore Gazette Reporter
Business owners are cobbling together their own plans in an effort to design a compromise for the reconstruction of Erie Boulevard. They’ve marked up Clough Harbour’s drawings and provided designs of their own that they believe will make the road more attractive, safer for drivers and pedestrians, and still allow the businesses to thrive. On Tuesday they’ll find out how persuasive their efforts have been. Clough Harbour engineers will present a revised plan to the Schenectady City Council at its 5 p.m. committee meeting in the council chambers at City Hall. Decades of experience in running a business may not be adequate preparation for a crash course in engineering, but some business owners believe they’ve come up with a plan that will end the year-long debate over how to rebuild the road. “I spent a week, day and night, thinking outside the box,” said property owner Carl Liss before presenting his idea to Clough Harbour last week. He leases space to several business owners on Erie Boulevard. “I think there’s a way to have the parking and a roundabout that stops T-bone accidents,” he said, adding that after some research he decided that the road does need some divider to reduce accidents. “I admit, that sounds like a good idea,” he said. He proposed a “stretched-out” roundabout, essentially turning the last block of Erie Boulevard into two one-way traffic lanes separated by a narrow median and connected by U-turns at both ends. He fi gures customers will be willing to circle around to their destination if they can see the route in front of them. “Within sight there’s a U-turn. No big deal,” he said. Clough Harbour’s plan has customers entering I-890 and merging across five lanes to get to the businesses on the southeast end of the street, location of Wendy’s and Lyle’s Hoagies; that part of the road would be open only to oneway traffic heading toward State Street. They have proposed adding a U-turn near I-890 so that drivers won’t have to enter the interstate to get to those stores, but Liss said his idea was better because it eliminates the roundabout entirely. He also suggested a narrow median, no more than 4 feet wide, so that there would be space for diagonal parking on both sides of the street. Some of that parking is eliminated in Clough Harbour’s plan. “Three to four feet is enough for these trees,” Liss said. “We can maintain the diagonal parking and put a 10-foot buffer between the driving lane and the parking so you’re going to be able to, relatively safely, back out and proceed.” That plan would cost much less than the $14 million earmarked for the street, but Liss isn’t suggesting that the city return the rest of the state and federal grants that have been offered in support of the project. Instead, he wants the city to build another street behind the businesses on the southeast edge of the boulevard. Drivers could enter from I-890 and park in new lots built behind the stores. “If you do this, you’re going to save significant money. So you can do a relatively simple thing — have a one-way, one-lane, slow-speed street,” Liss said. “The people could come into these parking lots and make a right turn out. People could flow in, flow out. There’s space back there that’s just trees that could be developed into parking.” Clough Harbour landscape architect Scott Lewendon said Liss’ idea was similar to one of the top three proposals considered by the firm. “We’ve looked at that,” he said, referring to the idea of replacing the roundabout with two U-turns. But, he said, Clough Harbour decided a roundabout was best. “It is the preferred intersection,” he said. As for a new road behind the southeast businesses, Lewendon said he would have included that in his plan if the city had enough money for it. He agreed that the area needs a service road, particularly for truck deliveries. But it’s too expensive to do both a service road and a roundabout, he said. “It is a huge expense. At this point of time we believe it’s beyond the scope of this project,” he told Liss. But he added, “I’ve taken down a lot of notes. This is not a final plan. This is a work in progress. Hopefully when we come out of this meeting, we will make improvements.” After the presentation to the council, he will present a fi nal plan to the public on Sept. 18 at Proctors’ GE Theatre. He declined to discuss whether the final plan would include a roundabout, but made it clear that he prefers it. In his meeting with Liss and other business owners, he said the firm made a mistake when it failed to quickly persuade residents to support the roundabout. Despite discussing it for more than an hour at the only public presentation of the plan, he said the firm should have done more to push the value of a roundabout. “There were things we did wrong. We didn’t give enough information about roundabouts,” he said. “We were hoping we could educate the public at that time. We don’t think we’ve convinced everyone this is the way to go.”
On Tuesday they’ll find out how persuasive their efforts have been. Clough Harbour engineers will present a revised plan to the Schenectady City Council at its 5 p.m. committee meeting in the council chambers at City Hall.
I don't understand this. Why isn't this revised plan being shown at the city council meetings? Why are they presenting it at the committee meeting in the council chambers?
I think that his highly controversial issue should be presented in it's entirely at a city council meeting for public comment.
When the INSANE are running the ASYLUM In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
“How fortunate for those in power that people never think.” Adolph Hitler
While I agree it should be presented at a City Council meeting, in public. I think the public comment should be set aside until they get a chance to review and discuss the revised plan with the engineering firm....also in public of course.
Erie Boulevard project would be bad news for business
As a downtown Erie Boulevard businessman, I attended the informational meeting held on Aug. 18 to discuss the Erie Boulevard project. I object to the proposal on the following grounds: It was apparent to me that at the last meeting, the business community was not solicited for input on this project. This is strange since we are the ones most affected by it. Parking in the area will be reduced by approximately 50 percent, creating a disadvantage for consumers who want to do patronize any Erie Boulevard business. Traffic entering Erie Boulevard from the I-890 arterial has always been a problem with controlling the speed. In my opinion, the “roundabout” proposed is more a popular catch phrase than a deterrent to traffic speed. Deliveries to Erie Boulevard businesses would be difficult at best, because large trucks would have to unload in the street since many businesses have no rear access. The length of time estimated to complete the project (two to three years) will certainly have an adverse effect on Erie Boulevard merchants. If the street is even partially shut down for long periods of time as State Street was during that project, you will force merchants out of business or drive them out of Schenectady. With the proposed project, snow removal appears problematic and could impact business during the winter months. While the objective of creating a beautiful Erie Boulevard to enhance the appearance of downtown Schenectady is a worthy one, it will be accomplished at the expense of creating a non-marketable commercial area where storefront owners will be unable to rent or sell their properties because consumers will be restricted from trading in this area as a result of the present design. What good is a beautiful boulevard if it is lined with empty, unused commercial spaces? If the city continues to proceed with this proposed project, it will cause me to seek another location for my business prior to the start of construction. Mine may be the first empty store on Erie Boulevard as a result of this project, but I am sure it will not be the last. GARY SAWYER Schenectady The writer is president of United Appliance Parts.
SCHENECTADY Council eyes changes to Erie plan Roundabout still part of project BY STEVEN COOK Gazette Reporter
The City Council Tuesday got its latest look at the Erie Boulevard redesign project, including what engineers said were significant changes. But even with the changes, business owners still panned the proposal, citing a controversial roundabout and what they termed uncrossable medians. “It still obscures businesses, whether northbound or southbound,” said Sarah Michener, owner of Annabel’s, on Ferry Street, and a member of the group of business owners opposing the project. “Anyone who isn’t very, very familiar with Erie Boulevard will have a hard time accessing the businesses.” More than 30 business operators met in July and agreed to fight for the complete removal of the roundabout from the $14 million Erie Boulevard reconstruction plan. Some changes were on display Tuesday, including a turnaround near I-890 to allow access to businesses on the east side. Lanes were also added for better delivery traffic, and the possibility was left open for an access road. The turnaround had been announced earlier. Scott Lewendon and Joe Cimino, of Clough Harbour Associates engineering firm, presented the updated plan to the council, touting the changes. A public information meeting has been scheduled for Sept. 18 at the GE Theatre. The time has yet to be set. Engineers will be there to present the plan and take further suggestions and questions. The plan is still a work in progress, officials said. Officials will also be there to better explain what they say are the benefits of roundabouts. Those benefits can include a turnaround point and slowing of traffic. The roundabout, coupled with medians, also prevents potentially dangerous left-hand turns. But the roundabout would still force two businesses to relocate. To make space, the city would use eminent domain to take and demolish the Another World adult bookstore and The Gun Store next door. Bookstore owner Rocco Palmer or- ganized his fellow business owners to fight the roundabout when he learned of the plan. Down the street, engineers added the turnaround near I-890, despite some concerns about turning into traffic coming onto Erie Boulevard. But engineers decided that risk was less than making traffic enter the loop system to return to Erie on the other side. Other topics covered included a left turn from Erie onto State. Offi cials said they will study that. They said snowplowing would be done with little added difficulty. Mayor Brian U. Stratton reiterated that he believes the roundabout is the best option. He acknowledged the business owners’ concerns, but said no project can please everyone. “It’s not merely a project geared toward servicing existing businesses,” Stratton said. He said they will do everything they can to address the concerns “knowing full well we’re will not going to make 100 percent of the people absolutely happy, and that is the case with any large public works project.”
Mayor Brian U. Stratton reiterated that he believes the roundabout is the best option. He acknowledged the business owners’ concerns, but said no project can please everyone.
The politicians, including Mayor BS, are steadfast in their position that there will be a roundabout on Erie Boulevard. This is the only means by which the city and county governments can seize the property, through eminent domain proceedings, in which the adult store and the gun shop conduct business.
The alternate plans (as I understand them) address the stated objectives of slowing traffic, beautifying the streetscape and providing parking without limiting access to businesses or incurring the expense ($14M) of constructing an unnecessary roundabout. The alternate plans could be implemented at a much lower cost. The remainder of the funds provided by the state, county, and city should be used to repair the roads, bridges, and sewers that are decaying throughout the city and the county.
The business owners who oppose the Mayor's plan should file a class action lawsuit against the City of Schenectady, Schenectady County, Mayor BS, and the City Council. These folks were elected to represent the constituents including the business owners, property owners, employees of businesses in the area, and those who shop at the businesses that are located on Erie Boulevard. Other than the politicians and the contractors who will likely construct the rotary, I hear of noone who is "pleased" with the plan.
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